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Acest subforum este destinat dezbaterilor filosofice. Pentru discutii religioase va initam sa vizitati subforumul Universul Credintei.

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> O Lectie De La Bosimani
March
mesaj 3 Jul 2009, 03:58 PM
Mesaj #421


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QUOTE(jet li @ 3 Jul 2009, 11:24 AM) *
Era un interviu prin filmul de mai sus "Cum e sa locuiesti pe aceasi strada cu Hell's Angels ?" "Foarte bine, ne ajuta sunt respectuosi si nici un hot nu indrazneste sa vina aici" .

rofl.gif Esti ca o oaie ratacita ! Parca in Biblie se spune ceva despre asta ?


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jet li
mesaj 6 Jul 2009, 10:00 AM
Mesaj #422


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Then there are the Chugach Natives of Alaska. The Port of Valdez, Alaska, is arguably one of the most valuable pieces of real estate on Earth, the only earthquake-safe ice-free port in Alaska that could load oil from the giant North Slope field. In 1969, Exxon and British Petroleum companies took the land from the Chugach and paid them one dollar. I kid you not.

Wally Hickel, the former Governor of Alaska, dismissed my suggestion that the Chugach deserved a bit more respect (and cash) for their property. "Land ownership comes in two ways, Mr. Palast." explained the governor and pipeline magnate, "Purchase or conquest. The fact that your granddaddy chased a caribou across the land doesn't make it yours." The Chugach had lived there for 3,000 years.

No oil company would dream of digging on the Bush family properties in Midland, Texas, without paying a royalty. Or drilling near Malibu without the latest in environmental protections. But when Natives are on top of Exxon's or BP's glory hole, suddenly, the great defenders of private property rights turn quite Bolshevik: lands can be seized for The Public's Need for Oil.


Some Natives are "re-located" through legal flim-flam, some at gunpoint. The less lucky are left to wallow, literally, in the gunk left by the drilling process.

http://www.gregpalast.com/oil-and-indians-...-mix/#more-2549


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March
mesaj 6 Jul 2009, 10:22 AM
Mesaj #423


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@Jet Li
Ti-am mai spus. Da un rezumat in rromineste cu trimitere la polologhia in engleza.


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Promo Contextual
mesaj 6 Jul 2009, 10:22 AM
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ContextuALL









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jet li
mesaj 6 Jul 2009, 10:54 AM
Mesaj #424


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Cand e vorba de respectarea proprietatii - conteaza cati bani ai. Nimeni nu vine la ferma lui Bush sa ii spuna : "pleaca ba, e nevoie de petrol pentru tara si popor". Vine si plateste cat ii cere.
Daca insa doar ai trait acolo cateva mii de ani, nu poti sta in calea binelui comun, aparatorii dreptului la proprietate , America, capitalism, democratie, imediat devin comunisti si spun "pentru binele comun, sa aiba lumea petrol, o sa dispareti de aici si o sa ne lasati sa foram, mai vreti si bani ?".

Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 6 Jul 2009, 10:55 AM


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turbo trabant
mesaj 6 Jul 2009, 01:23 PM
Mesaj #425


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eu sunt curios daca jet prezinta aceste linkuri si la colegii de munca smile.gif.

jet taica, nu vrei sa muncesti , fa-ti taica sindicat biggrin.gif


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Romanii, ca popor, sunt prosti. Nu va chinuiti sa raspundeti, considerati posturile drept opera unui dusman al poporului.

Ba, ia faceti liniste si ordine, ce dreacu!
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jet li
mesaj 8 Jul 2009, 09:30 AM
Mesaj #426


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Da ce, tu vrei sa muncesti ? Daca te imbogatesti mai "vrei" ? Daca insa se intampla sa faci cea ce faci la munca, pentru ca iti place, fara program, sefi, instructiuni, sau probleme de profit, chiar daca este exact acelasi lucru - aia nu e munca, e joaca si asa trebuie sa fie tot ce facem. Organizarea nu ne permite.

Vedeti compania aia din Japonia care scaneaza fata angajatilor cu un computer sa fie siguri ca zambesc pentru clienti. Asta e "era moderna" in esenta ei.
http://cryptogon.com/?p=9735

QUOTE
One of the most pernicious manifestations of the control and, therefore, elimination of play has come through organized sports, which started with Little League and extend today into all sports and all age groups. The sandlot, the playground, the neighborhood, and the vacant lot, where children were once free to hammer out their own rules, choose their own teams, and resolve their own disputes, have been replaced by yet another supervised realm where play means going through a prescribed set of motions and where the social interaction is mediated and guided by authority. In a way, the children do not play the game at all: the game plays the children, who are just accessories, placeholders fulfilling functions determined by rules created and enforced by adults. Here play has lost its essential creative nature. I do not know what to call it, but it really is not play any more at all. It is, however, an excellent conditioning method for producing people who look to authority for instructions on how to "play the game". Have you ever felt like you are, still, one of these "placeholders" fulfilling functions determined and enforced by some unchallengeable authority?

The globe of my childhood was already a step away from real life, the open-ended infinite that is nature, the real world. Already, what I was exploring was a manufactured representation of the world. At least, though, my experience within the confines of that representation was unprogrammed. Through my imaginings, I still played with that globe. It did not play me, turn me into its operator, the button-pusher that moves the game from start to finish.

Like a child moving through his lessons at school, making his way through the prescribed body of information that constitutes an "education," like a bunch of confused six-year-olds trying to follow the instructions of their t-ball coach, so do we move through modern life. We go through the steps of a life prepared for us by others, a life that is not our own. As the final step in the conversion of the whole world into money, we are selling off our very lives.


What is important here is not so much money but control. The destruction of the human spirit, accomplished mostly during childhood and maintained to the grave, is another aspect of the taming of the wild, the conquest of nature, the fulfillment of the technological and scientific program at the level of the individual. Life, in other words, has been brought under control, or so we would persuade ourselves. Why else the emphasis on safety, security, and practicality? As observed, these boil down to an emphasis on survival, which, in our specialized society, is a function of money. Again, we are selling off our very lives, purchasing experiences instead of creating them, being run by our machines, our schedules, our clocks and our calendars. Time is money.

There are other aspects to the conversion of spiritual capital into money, the diminishment of the human spirit for the sake of profit. Each human being is born as a magnificent, creative, spontaneous spirit, an enormous spiritual being capable of incredible feats of learning. To reduce that spirit to something willing to occupy one of the narrow, meaningless roles in society as we know it, to make that spirit accept the imitation of life today's world offers (and upon which our economy depends), is an enormous enterprise and a shameful crime. We do not really understand what is happening when, as children and teenagers, vast swaths of our spirit are sold off to the demands of the monetized world. We know only that we have been robbed.

http://www.ascentofhumanity.com/chapter4-7.php

Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 8 Jul 2009, 09:31 AM


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March
mesaj 8 Jul 2009, 10:10 AM
Mesaj #427


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QUOTE(jet li @ 8 Jul 2009, 10:30 AM) *
Vedeti compania aia din Japonia care scaneaza fata angajatilor cu un computer sa fie siguri ca zambesc pentru clienti.

Si care-i treaba ta ? Ca doar tu traiesti printre bosimani si nu in Japonia .


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Felina
mesaj 8 Jul 2009, 11:21 AM
Mesaj #428


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QUOTE(jet li @ 8 Jul 2009, 08:30 AM) *
Daca insa se intampla sa faci cea ce faci la munca, pentru ca iti place, fara program, sefi, instructiuni, sau probleme de profit, chiar daca este exact acelasi lucru - aia nu e munca, e joaca si asa trebuie sa fie tot ce facem.


thumb_yello.gif


Si totusi, societatea iti permite sa fi liber intreprinzator, poti lucra pe cont propriu si sa traiesti de pe urma muncii tale, singura problema e ca dupa atatia ani de scoala si de indoctrinare cu valorile societatii moderne, prea putini isi mai gasesc curajul sa creada ca pot face fata vietii pe cont propriu, daca nu in afara sistemului, macar la marginea lui.


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Never asume.
A friend told me I was delusional. I almost fell off of my unicorn.
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jet li
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 12:58 PM
Mesaj #429


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QUOTE
"The twentieth-century linguistic revolution," says Boston University anthropologist Misia Landau, "is the recognition that language is not merely a device for communicating ideas about the world, but rather a tool for bringing the world into existence in the first place. Reality is not simply `experienced' or `reflected' in language, but instead is actually produced by language. "

From the point of view of the psychedelic shaman, the world appears to be more in the nature of an utterance or a tale than in any way related to the leptons and baryons or charge and spin that our high priests, the physicists, speak of. For the shaman, the cosmos is a tale that becomes true as it is told, and as it tells itself.
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Because our maps of reality are determined by our present circumstances, we tend to lose awareness of the larger patterns of time and space. Only by gaining access to the Transcendent Other can those patterns of time and space and our role in them be glimpsed. Shamanism strives for this higher point of view, which is achieved through a feat of linguistic prowess. A shaman is one who has attained a vision of the beginnings and the endings of all things and who can communicate that vision. To the rational thinker, this is inconceivable, yet the techniques of shamanism are directed toward this end and this is the source of their power.

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Common sense assumes that, though languages are always evolving, the raw stuff of what language expresses is relatively constant and common to all humans. Yet we also know that the Hopi language has no past or future tenses or concepts. How, then, can the Hopi world be like ours? And the Inuit have no first-person pronoun. How, then, can their world be like ours?


http://www.the-globalvillage.com/polityzen...e-Gods_v1.0.pdf

Indienii Lakota nu aveau cuvantul "eu". Nu exista in limba lor. Intotdeauna era vorba de :"noi". Cu toate astea nu erau "multi da prosti" ci foarte individuali si liberi (Adica distincti dar nu in sensul de "separati"). Cum poate fi lumea lor la fel ca a noastra ?

Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 13 Jul 2009, 01:02 PM


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Rehael
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 01:33 PM
Mesaj #430


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E foarte interesant ce spui legat de cuvantul "noi". Ma gandesc ca poate fi doar o "mostenire" straveche a limbii tribului, pentru ca nu-mi pot imagina ca mai poti fi atat de liber si individualist asimilandu-l permanent cu ideea de unitate a comunitatii.
Este o situatie similara celei din limba engleza, in care ai putea sa spui ca nu exista decat cuvantul "voi" sau "dumneavoastra", nicidecum "tu". Ceea ce ar lasa sa se inteleaga ca englezii ar fi un popor extrem de respectuos, care vorbesc orisicui cu dumneavoastra, dar in realitate... sunt in limitele normalului, anomalia de exprimare netransformandu-i pe toti englezii in persoane respectoase.


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jet li
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 01:54 PM
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QUOTE(Rehael @ 13 Jul 2009, 03:33 PM) *
E foarte interesant ce spui legat de cuvantul "noi". Ma gandesc ca poate fi doar o "mostenire" straveche a limbii tribului, pentru ca nu-mi pot imagina ca mai poti fi atat de liber si individualist asimilandu-l permanent cu ideea de unitate a comunitatii.


Crezi ca putea cineva sa ii dea ordine lui Crazy Horse ? Sau oricarui indian ? Intre ei nici unul nu ii spunea altuia ce sa faca, la fel cum intre prieteni nu ai nici o dorinta sa incepi sa dai ordine. Nu exista un ego separat de trib.

http://www.ascentofhumanity.com/chapter4-1.php
QUOTE
As that word mine indicates, ownership implies an attachment of things to self. The more we own, the more we are. The constellation of me and mine grows. But no matter how large the discrete and separate self grows, it is still far smaller than the self of the hunter-gatherer. The pre-separation mind is able to affirm, all at once and without contradiction, "I am this body," "I am this tribe," "I am the jungle," "I am the world." No matter how much of the jungle we control, we are smaller than the one who knows, "I am the jungle." No matter how dominant we are socially, we are far less than one who knows, "I am my tribe." And far less secure, too, because all of these appendages to our tiny separate selves may be easily sundered from us. We are therefore perpetually and irremediably insecure. We go to great lengths to protect all these accessories of identity, our possessions and money and reputations, and when our house is burglarized, our wallet stolen, or our reputation besmirched, we feel as if our very selves have been violated.

Not only does our acquisitiveness arise out of separation, it reinforces it as well. The notion that a forest, a gene, an idea, an image, a song is a separate thing that admits ownership is quite new. Who are we to own a piece of the world, to separate out a part of the sacred universe and make it mine? Such hubris, once unknown in the world, has had the unfortunate effect of separating out ourselves as well from the matrix of reality, cutting us off (in experience if not in fact) from each other, from nature, and from spirit. By objectifying the world and everything in it, by making an other of the world, we necessarily objectify ourselves as well in relation to that other. The self becomes a lonely and isolated ego, connected to the world pragmatically but not in essence, afraid of death and thus closed to life.


QUOTE
To a person identified with tribe, forest, and planet, the death of the body and all it controls is far less frightening. Another way to describe such a person is that he or she is in love with the world. Love is antidote to fear of death, because it expands one's boundaries beyond what can be lost. Conversely, fear of death blocks love by shutting us in and making us small. And fear of death is built into our ideology—the self-definition implicit in objectivist science.

Money and property simply enforce this self-definition. They are concrete manifestations of the separate self, the self that is afraid of death and closed to love. Money, in its present form, is anti-love. But it is not the root of all evil, just another expression of separation, another piece of the puzzle. Other systems of money are possible that have the opposite effect of our present currency, structurally discouraging the accumulation of me and mine. Curious? Keep reading... I'll get to them in Chapter Seven.


Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 13 Jul 2009, 01:55 PM


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Rehael
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 02:00 PM
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QUOTE(jet li @ 13 Jul 2009, 02:54 PM) *
Crezi ca putea cineva sa ii dea ordine lui Crazy Horse ? Sau oricarui indian ? Intre ei nici unul nu ii spunea altuia ce sa faca, la fel cum intre prieteni nu ai nici o dorinta sa incepi sa dai ordine. Nu exista un ego separat de trib.


Adica zici ca era un trib fara sef si fara sfatul batranilor? Ma cam indoiesc... smile.gif
Daca niste oameni sunt prieteni, asta nu inseamna ca nu se vor sfatui niciodata, ceea ce inseamna ca unul dintre ei. la un moment dat, poate sa asculte ce-i spune altul sa faca.


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March
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 02:32 PM
Mesaj #433


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QUOTE(jet li @ 13 Jul 2009, 02:54 PM) *
Crezi ca putea cineva sa ii dea ordine lui Crazy Horse ? Sau oricarui indian ? Intre ei nici unul nu ii spunea altuia ce sa faca, la fel cum intre prieteni nu ai nici o dorinta sa incepi sa dai ordine. Nu exista un ego separat de trib.


Ai calatorit in Canada sau US ? Ai fost vreodata in vreo rezervatie a indienilor de acolo ? Da' intr-un cazino ce-l opereaza ei in aceste rezervatii ?


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turbo trabant
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 02:34 PM
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QUOTE(March @ 13 Jul 2009, 02:32 PM) *
Ai fost vreodata in vreo rezervatie a indienilor de acolo ?

toti indienii au harley davidson si sunt membri cu carnetel in clubul de golf hell's angels. rofl.gif


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Romanii, ca popor, sunt prosti. Nu va chinuiti sa raspundeti, considerati posturile drept opera unui dusman al poporului.

Ba, ia faceti liniste si ordine, ce dreacu!
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jet li
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 02:45 PM
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QUOTE(Rehael @ 13 Jul 2009, 04:00 PM) *
Adica zici ca era un trib fara sef si fara sfatul batranilor? Ma cam indoiesc... smile.gif
Daca niste oameni sunt prieteni, asta nu inseamna ca nu se vor sfatui niciodata, ceea ce inseamna ca unul dintre ei. la un moment dat, poate sa asculte ce-i spune altul sa faca.

Cea ce inseamna ca nu se dau ordine. Sfatul e sfat. Nu ordin pentru care sa fii pedepsit. Intr-un grup de prieteni, de ce stati impreuna ? Daca stati impreuna inseamna cumva ca nu faceti nimic ? Sau ca daca unul nu are chef de ceva il fortati ? Daca unul spune sa faceti ceva - sunt sigur ca nu il consideri un ordin. E urmat doar daca e respectat, la fel ca un sef indian.
Desigur, daca unul incepe sa va bata sau sa va omoare- e exclus din grup. La fel cum era exilat de indieni. Fara nici o lege, nu e nevoie de asa ceva.
Nu vorbesc de indienii de azi. Vorbesc de triburi.


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Rehael
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 03:03 PM
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Buey, adica daca cineva ar fi incalcat legea tribului nu i-ar fi fost aplicata nici o corectie, asa cu toata prietenia?


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jet li
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 03:11 PM
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Nu existau legi scrise nici pedepse impersonale. Legile unui grup de prieteni. Fa ceva care sa nege idea ca esti prieten cu ceilalti si o sa fii "pedepsit". Fara nimic formal, dar e foarte simplu : nu mai poti sta in tribul tau dupa ce ai omorat unul din ei de ex.

Dar am deviat de la ce ziceam : nu exista cuvantul "eu".

QUOTE
The Moken, also known as the "sea gypsies", are a nomadic people living off the coasts of Burma and Thailand.

In their language, there is no word for " want."

Think about it.
(Above reported in The Sunday Times.)

This reminded me of my visit to the Quechuan Indians high up in the Andes in Peru in 1998. Most of the tribe had never met anyone from the " developed world" at that time.

In their language, there is no word for "I" nor indeed is there any word for "doubt."

I recall asking one of their leaders whether or not he ever got depressed. My English was translated to Spanish and then to Quechuan. Pasculito the Shaman was mindboggled by this word. Couldn't understand it!

No want, no I, no doubt - developed wisdom from an "undeveloped world."


Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 13 Jul 2009, 03:15 PM


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Rehael
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 03:21 PM
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QUOTE
Fa ceva care sa nege idea ca esti prieten cu ceilalti si o sa fii "pedepsit".


Si ce-i asa de deosebit in treaba asta? Mi se pare ca se intampla exact ca in comunitatile fetelor palide.

Iar in ceea ce priveste cuvantul "eu", e o anomalie de aceeasi natura ca englezescul "you".


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jet li
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 03:22 PM
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"anomalie" ? Ce i aia ?
"de aceasi natura" ?
Vezi mai sus. Treaba cu lipsa "eu" era des intalnita in triburi.

QUOTE
The pre-separation mind is able to affirm, all at once and without contradiction, "I am this body," "I am this tribe," "I am the jungle," "I am the world." No matter how much of the jungle we control, we are smaller than the one who knows, "I am the jungle." No matter how dominant we are socially, we are far less than one who knows, "I am my tribe." And far less secure, too, because all of these appendages to our tiny separate selves may be easily sundered from us



Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 13 Jul 2009, 03:24 PM


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Rehael
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 03:30 PM
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QUOTE(jet li @ 13 Jul 2009, 04:22 PM) *
"anomalie" ? Ce i aia ?
"de aceasi natura" ?
Vezi mai sus. Treaba cu lipsa "eu" era des intalnita in triburi.


Si daca?... Nici englezii nu sunt neaparat politicosi cand iti vorbesc cu "you". Asa cum you poate insemna si tu si voi si dumneavoastra, este posibil ca si ei sa aiba un singur cuvant pentru "eu" si "noi", cum si noi avem un singur cuvant "ochi", atat pentru singular cat si pentru plural.


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March
mesaj 13 Jul 2009, 03:44 PM
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QUOTE(turbo trabant @ 13 Jul 2009, 03:34 PM) *
toti indienii au harley davidson si sunt membri cu carnetel in clubul de golf hell's angels. rofl.gif

Cica nu exista "eu" la indienii astia. Ce le trebuie atata timp cat ei ( asta exista ) primesc lunar o gramada de bani de la Unchiul Sam cica pentru pamanturile furate ?!
Plus alta gramada de gratuitati si tigari si bautura free tax, sistem propriu de asistenta medicala gratuita , case si utilitati gratuite si alte facilitati toate separate de sistemul legal federal astfel ca daca un indian comite un delict si se refugiaza in rezervatie acesta nu poate fi "extradat" autoritatilor federale decat cu aprobarea "guvernului " tribal al rezervatiei !

Acest topic a fost editat de March: 13 Jul 2009, 03:45 PM


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jet li
mesaj 14 Jul 2009, 01:40 PM
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QUOTE
What, then, of the victims? What shall we say to the men, women, and children whose ruined lives have followed in the wake of our "ascent"? Should we not lament the billions of passenger pigeons whose flocks once darkened the skies? Should we not mourn the dodo, the great auk, the American chestnut, and the millions more now following them to extinction? What of the elder bushes, a century old, keystone species of a fantastic ecology torn up and paved over to build a new road? What of the forests turned to deserts? The native children shot for sport by white settlers? The women tortured and burned alive as witches for practicing herbal medicine? The schoolchildren today, cajoled, coerced, and medicated into spending the Kingdom of Childhood behind a desk, in a room, standing in line? The coal miners of 19th-century England, emerging decades later stunted, broken, and destitute from the mines? The babies deprived of the breast? The women raped, the men tortured and killed, the children watching the soldiers who did it? What can we say of the concentration camps, Auschwitz, the Gulag, the unspeakable hardship of the men sentenced to a lingering death at hard labor? What shall we say to the victims of communist purges, and to the families sent a bill for the executioner's bullet? What of the black man beaten and lynched, and a picture postcard of the event sent to his mother? What shall we say to the starving children, past the point of hunger, bodies falling apart? And what shall we say to their mothers? And what of the children working working in toy factories, rug factories, chocolate plantations? The countless assembly line workers, their human creativity reduced to a few rote movements, producing empty consumer junk out of toxic materials destined sooner rather than later for the landfill? The betrayal after betrayal of the Native Americans, people massacred, lands cheated, religion outlawed, culture purposefully destroyed? The cancer victims of a poisoned world? The slaves long ago who labored on the Pyramids? Contrast a life carrying stone to the life of a hunter-gatherer, and the bargain we have made becomes clear. In this, the first monument to the Machine, the folly and the horror of our ascent is clear: an exchange of life for labor to erect a useless edifice.

http://www.ascentofhumanity.com/chapter8-5.php


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March
mesaj 15 Jul 2009, 10:57 AM
Mesaj #443


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Jet Li , aici nu-i gazeta de perete unde sa afisezi continuu asemenea extracte kilometrice si pe deasupra si in engleza. Mai lasa-ne domn'e !


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jet li
mesaj 16 Jul 2009, 09:17 AM
Mesaj #444


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Asa e la moda acu. Pe vremuri era franceza.

Uite aici unu care s-a trezit, incredibil articol pentru un ziar important din Anglia. Isi da seama de arificialitatea pentru care muncim ca prostii sa-i dam importanta si ne pierdem pe noi insine. Intr-adevar nu mai e nici o valoare a civilizatiei care sa merite respectata. Raman cele tribale. Naturale si care nu au nevoie de legi si formalitati.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/20...titutions-faith
QUOTE
It's all gone wrong. Our belief in everything has been shattered by a series of shock revelations that have shaken our core to its core. You can't move for toppling institutions. Television, the economy, the police, the House of Commons, and, most recently, the press ... all revealed to be jam-packed with liars and bastards and graspers and bullies and turds.

And we knew. We knew. But we were deep in denial, like a cuckolded partner who knows the sorry truth but tries their best to ignore it. Over the last 18 months the spotlight of truth has swung this way and that, and one institution after another was suddenly exposed as being precisely as rotten as we always thought it was. What's that? Phone-in TV quizzes might a bit of con? The economic boom is an unsustainable fantasy? Riot police can be a little "handy"? MPs are greedy? The News of the World might have used underhand tactics to get a story? What next? Oxygen is flavourless? Cows stink at water polo? Children are overrated? We knew all this stuff. We just didn't have the details.


QUOTE
What about each other? Society? Can we trust us? Doubt it. We're probably not even real, as was revealed in the popular documentary The Matrix. That bloke next door? Made of pixels. Your co-workers? Pixels. You? One pixel. One measly pixel. You haven't even got shoes, for Christ's sake.

As the very fabric of life breaks down around us, even language itself seems unreliable. These words don't make sense. The vowels and consonants you're hearing in your mind's ear right now are being generated by mere squiggles on a page or screen. Pointless hieroglyphics. Shapes. You're staring at shapes and hearing them in your head. When you see the word "trust", can you even trust that? Why? It's just shapes!

Right now all our faith has poured out of the old institutions, and there's nowhere left to put it. We need new institutions to believe in, and fast. Doesn't matter what they're made of. Knit them out of string, wool, anything. Quickly, quickly. Before we start worshipping insects.


Cititi mai ales sfarsitul. Apoi cititi partea asta din "Ishmael":
http://www.scribd.com/doc/7829409/Daniel-Q...Ismael-Romanian
QUOTE
— Corect. Povestirea pe care Takerii o pun īn scenă aici de zece mii de ani nu doar că e dezastruoasă pentru omenire şi pentru această lume, ci e şi fundamental nesănătoasă şi nesatisfăcătoare. Este fantezia unui megaloman, iar punerea ei īn īn scenă a dat Takerilor o cultură ciuruită de lăcomie, cruzime, boli mentale, infracţiuni şi dependenţă de droguri.
— Da, aşa se pare.
— Povestirea pe care Leaverii o pun īn scenă aici de trei milioane de ani nu-i o povestire a cuceririi şi a stăpānirii. Punerea ei īn scenă nu le dă putere. Īn schimb, punerea ei īn scenă le dă vieţi satisfăcătoare şi pline de semnificaţie. Aste vei găsi printre aceştia. Ei nu fierb de nemulţumire şi de rebeliune, nu se ciondănesc veşnic, dezbătānd ce ar trebui permis şi ce ar trebui interzis, nu se acuză intr-una unii pe alţii cum că nu trăiesc cum trebuie, nu trăiesc īn teroare unii faţă de ceilalţi, nu-şi pierd minţile pentru că vieţile lor par atāt de goale şi lipsite de sens, nu au nevoie să se drogheze cu stupefiante pentru a putea rezista īncă o zi, nu inventează cāte o nouă religie săptămānal pentru a avea ceva de care să se agaţe, nu caută īntr-una ceva de făcut sau ceva īn care să creadă care să le facă vieţile să merite a fi trăite. Şi repet, asta nu-i din cauză că trăiesc aproape de natură sau pentru că nu au nici un fel de conducere formală sau pentru că ar fi nobili din naştere. E pur şi simplu din cauză că pun īn scenă o povestire care funcţionează foarte bine pentru oameni, o povestire care a funcţionat bine timp de trei milioane de ani, şi care īncă mai funcţionează bine acolo unde Takerii īncă n-au reuşit s-o strivească sub picioare.





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turbo trabant
mesaj 17 Jul 2009, 06:55 PM
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QUOTE(jet li @ 16 Jul 2009, 09:17 AM) *
Intr-adevar nu mai e nici o valoare a civilizatiei care sa merite respectata.

And the Nobel prize pentru inventarea apei calde goes to....

Sa ne scrii din trib . "Valoarea mea, valoarea mea nu o are nimenea. " spoton.gif


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Romanii, ca popor, sunt prosti. Nu va chinuiti sa raspundeti, considerati posturile drept opera unui dusman al poporului.

Ba, ia faceti liniste si ordine, ce dreacu!
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mesaj 18 Jul 2009, 09:15 AM
Mesaj #446


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QUOTE(jet li @ 16 Jul 2009, 10:17 AM) *
Asa e la moda acu. Pe vremuri era franceza.

Macar fa copy/paste in bosimana laugh.gif


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Nicolas Boileau


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Marduk
mesaj 18 Jul 2009, 04:44 PM
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QUOTE(jet li @ 16 Jul 2009, 10:17 AM) *
Asa e la moda acu. Pe vremuri era franceza.

Takerii, Leaverii........... etc.

What a f..k is this ?



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"Problema cu lumea este că proștii și fanaticii sunt īntotdeauna așa de siguri pe ei, īn timp ce oamenii īnțelepți sunt atāt de plini de īndoieli." (Bertrand Russell)

"A fi tolerant nu inseamnă a tolera intoleranţa altora" (Jules Romains)

LINEDRONE
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turbo trabant
mesaj 19 Jul 2009, 07:07 PM
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QUOTE(marduk @ 18 Jul 2009, 05:44 PM) *
Takerii, Leaverii
What a f..k is[/url]

E o noua categorie: F...ker rofl.gif


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Romanii, ca popor, sunt prosti. Nu va chinuiti sa raspundeti, considerati posturile drept opera unui dusman al poporului.

Ba, ia faceti liniste si ordine, ce dreacu!
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jet li
mesaj 21 Jul 2009, 09:17 AM
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marduk, ala sunt eu pe alt forum, ce crezi ca e smile.gif Gata. m-ati descoperit, va insel ! rofl.gif



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"The men where you live," said the little prince, "raise five thousand roses in thesame garden−− and they do not find in it what they are looking for." "They do not find it," I replied. "And yet what they are looking for could be found in one single rose, or in a little water."
"Yes, that is true," I said. And the little prince added: "But the eyes are blind. One must look with the heart..."

http://www.scribd.com/doc/12842911/Antoine...e-Little-Prince


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A Hopi Indian named Sun Chief said:

"I had learned many English words and could recite part of the Ten Commandments. I knew how to sleep on a bed, pray to Jesus, comb my hair, eat with a knife and fork, and use a toilet. ... I had also learned that a person thinks with his head instead of his heart ".


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"When Carl Jung, the great psychoanalyst, went to Taos Peublo in New Mexico in 1925, he met the chief of the native people, Ochwiay Biano. Biano told Jung that according to his people, the Whites were 'mad'-uneasy, restless, always wanting something.

Jung asked him why he thought they were mad, and the chief replied that it was because they thought with their heads, a sure sign of mental illness among his tribe. Jung asked him how he thought and he pointed to his heart. The response plunged Jung into a deep introspection that enabled him to see his race from outside himself and realise how much of the race's character was within him."


--------------------------------------


Papillon

Those who haven't been exposed to the hypocrisies of a "civilized" education react to things naturally, as they happen. It is in the here and now that they are either happy or unhappy, joyful or sad, interested or indifferent. The superiority of pure Indians like these Guajiros was striking. They could outdo us in everything: when they adopted someone, everything they had belonged to him; and when anyone showed them the least attention, they were profoundly moved


I was getting used to this life and beginning to realize that if I stayed too much longer I might lose all desire to leave.

(vedeti citatele de mai sus despre "gandire cu capul sau cu inima")

----------------------------


As Columbus wrote of the Arawak (before murdering and enslaving them), "They are so ingenuous and free with all they have, that no one would believe it who has not seen it... Of anything they possess, if it be asked of them, they never say no; on the contrary, they invite you to share it and show as much love as if their hearts went with it...
http://www.ascentofhumanity.com/chapter5-2.php

Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 21 Jul 2009, 09:19 AM


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Blakut
mesaj 28 Jul 2009, 12:22 PM
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QUOTE
One of the most pernicious manifestations of the control and, therefore, elimination of play has come through organized sports, which started with Little League and extend today into all sports and all age groups.


Mai jet, nu mai citi texte scrise de americani. Ca ei au impresia ca sportul organizat a inceput la ei odata cu baseballul. Sporturi organizate se practicau inca din antichitate... dar deh, americanii nu erau pe vremea aia.


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turbo trabant
mesaj 28 Jul 2009, 12:30 PM
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primul sport organizat a fost cand primul homo sapiens a intrat in pestera ursului deoarece il batuse nevasta la cap de niste blana 'de marca '.
si uite asa s-a inventat wrestling-ul si traficul la siteurile lui jet li.


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Romanii, ca popor, sunt prosti. Nu va chinuiti sa raspundeti, considerati posturile drept opera unui dusman al poporului.

Ba, ia faceti liniste si ordine, ce dreacu!
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jet li
mesaj 29 Jul 2009, 08:46 AM
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Sea Gypsies, un trib de vanatori culegatori. De fapt pescari.
http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2009/07/s...tanzania_a.html



A se vedea ce dinti au. Vanatorii culegatorii nu aveau problemele de sanatate pe care le au oamenii "civilizati", sedentari, traind in orasele lor otravitoare si care mananca gunoaie (mai nou cu multe chimicale).
De asemenea - tribul asta nu are in vocabular cuvantul "want" - "doresc". Vedeti postul de mai sus.
QUOTE
Nu mai avea insemnatate daca eram in anul 1947 al erei noastre sau inainte de era noastra. Traiam, si acest lucru il simteam cu intensitate. Inteleseram ca viata oamenilor fusese plina si inaintea erei tehnice, fara indoiala mai plina si mai bogata in multe privinte decat viata omului modern. Timpul si evolutia incetau oarecum sa mai existe : tot ce era real si tot ce avea importanta era astazi la fel ca ieri, la fel ca maine. Eram inghititi de masura absoluta a istoriei, de bezna adanca si neantrerupta de sub puzderia de stele.

Thor Heyerdahl - Kon Tiki


http://www.primitivism.com/loss-of-health.htm
QUOTE
Exposure to pesticides and metals in water, food, and air can permanently disrupt nervous system functioning and cause brain damage.6 Pesticide exposure is linked to hypertension,7 Parkinson's disease,8 epilepsy,9 and cardiovascular disorders. It can induce allergic sensitivities11 and possibly liver disease.'2 The common apple-preserving chemical daminozide, if ingested over a lifetime, can cause cancer.13 The pesticides captan, chlorothalonil, permethrin, acephate, parathion, dieldrin, methomyl, and folpet~etected by the Food and Drug Administration in apples, carrots, cauliflower, cherries, grapes, and peaches-are also carcinogenic. 14

Dioxins, the herbicides known for their use in Vietnam, are also used in the United States on farms, national forests, urban parks, and lawns. They can be a potent immunosuppressant, leaving the body open to secondary infections, allergies, and autoimmune disease,15 and a study reported in the Journal of the American Medical Association links use of dioxin by Kansas farmers with an eight-fold increase in non-Hodgkin's lymphoma.16

Industrial solvents are also extremely health-threatening. Chemicals like trichloroethylene, perchloroethylene, and l,2-transdichloro-ethylene are found in electronics plants and dry cleaning factories, as well as in the water supplies of industrial communities like Woburn, Massachusetts. They can cause recurrent infections, immunologic deterioration, leukemia,'1 and neurological disorders that can result in panic attacks, personality imbalances, and spinal cord lesions. 18 Health studies of Woburn residents over a fifteen-year period after documented exposure to trichloroethylene, dichloroethy-lene, tetrachloroethylene, and trichioroethane show a twofold and threefold increase in birth defects and infant deaths.


http://www.primitivism.com/health-civilization.htm
QUOTE
Even the poorest recorded hunter-gatherer group enjoys a caloric intake superior to that of impoverished contemporary urban populations. Prehistoric hunter-gatherers appear to have enjoyed richer environments and to have been better nourished than most subsequent populations (primitive and civilized alike). Whenever we can glimpse the remains of anatomically modern human beings who lived in early prehistoric environments still rich in large game, they are often relatively large people displaying comparatively few signs of qualitative malnutrition. The subsequent trend in human size and stature is irregular but is more often downward than upward in most parts of the world until the nineteenth or twentieth century.

The diets of hunter-gatherers appear to be comparatively well balanced, even when they are lean. Ethnographic accounts of contemporary groups suggest that protein intakes are commonly quite high, comparable to those of affluent modern groups and substantially above world averages. Protein deficiency is almost unknown in these groups, and vitamin and mineral deficiencies are rare and usually mild in comparison to rates reported from many Third World populations. Archaeological evidence suggests that specific deficiencies, including that of iron (anemia), vitamin D (rickets), and, more controversially, vitamin C (scurvy) as well as such general signs of protein calorie malnutrition as childhood growth retardation have generally become more common in history rather than declining.

Among farmers, increasing population required more and more frequent cropping of land and the use of more and more marginal soils, both of which further diminished returns for labor. This trend may or may not have been offset by such technological improvements in farming as the use of metal tools, specialization of labor, and efficiencies associated with large-scale production that tend to increase individual productivity as well as total production.

But whether the efficiency of farming increased or declined, the nutrition of individuals appears often to have declined for any of several reasons:


Acest topic a fost editat de jet li: 29 Jul 2009, 08:55 AM


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March
mesaj 29 Jul 2009, 12:34 PM
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ai uitat sa spui ca le place whiskey....


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Nicolas Boileau


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Rovaniemi
mesaj 29 Jul 2009, 12:55 PM
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O, da, ce liric era bietul Heyerdahl ... dar ai uitat să precizezi cam cum racţuionau cei 5 de pe plută īn ultimele zile ale călătoriei lor ... ceva de genul Paştele mă-sii de viaţă, cine m-a pus să mă īmbarc īn expediţia Kon-Tiki ... nu mai ajungem odată ...

Şi la sfīrşit: Yeeee, Rarotonga! Vivat!!!!

Dar mă rog, presupun că tu nu ai citit efectiv jurnalul lui Heyerdahl, ci doar ai găsit citatul ăla pe undeva, postat de cine ştie ce exaltat.


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Rovaniemi
mesaj 29 Jul 2009, 12:58 PM
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QUOTE(March @ 29 Jul 2009, 01:34 PM) *
ai uitat sa spui ca le place whiskey....


sau poate nu prea au ce mīnca ... şi atunci cum să-şi distrugă dinţii? thumb_yello.gif


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